PCY135 and PCY155 Help Please, Thanks!

[dmitri]

I set the Bthreshold now to 0 to disable the 3rd zone/dampening, I had tried this before and now it only reads rim hits or head hits depending on which on threshold is lower, if the head/bow is lower threshold it will play that note only on all three parts of my cymbal, if i lower the threshold of the rim/edge more than the head/bow that seems to take over the whole thing and only produce rim hits. If I happen to raise the thresholds to the recommended 42 for bow 30 for the head/edge and 0 for the third zone, then I am only left with rim hits on all three parts, again.

You seem to do it randomly. Do you have a clear understanding of what Threshold on the Head/Bow and on the Rim/Edge are for in a piezo/switch pad/cymbal and what the difference these Thresholds settings is?

[chunkyfatboy]

Yes in a previous thread you have stated, "For Yamaha cymbals, if BThreshold is set to 18 and Threshold to 40, then hits with simultaneous switch level below 18 will be registered as a bell, hits with simultaneous switch level between 18 and 40 will be registered as an edge, hits with simultaneous switch level above 40 will be registered as a bow." This means that thresholds are the numbers between which the hits register as a certain note, the velocities at which I hit it is represented by this number and thus should be the corresponding note.

Everything is still converting to the dampened note despite having Bthreshold at 0 and the DBnote at 0 which effectively should disable the note, the MIDI Log reads the following:

0.244 10 0x99 0x00 0x02 C -1 Note On

0.256 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off

1.474 10 0x99 0x00 0x03 C -1 Note On

0.261 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off

1.367 10 0x99 0x00 0x01 C -1 Note On

0.261 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off

0.653 10 0x99 0x00 0x01 C -1 Note On

0.254 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off


I know you said, "Set BThreshold to 0 to disable 3rd zone triggering/get rid of Dampened note triggering" and "make sure you have a separation between bow and edge zone," this is what I have been trying to do. But the dampened note takes over despite where I hit the PCY135 even with the Bthreshold set to 0 which should disable it.

Also for you're second piece of advice "If you don't get choke when you press the edge switch or you don't get edge triggering then you have to raise Threshold on the edge just as I advised you in the previous post." I have been trying this also, raising the threshold on the edge slowly with no choke notes whatsoever being detected despite how hard being pressed. The only note going through is the DBNote. I raised this to the maximum level from 0 by small increments to no success.

If BThreshold set to 0 disables the DBnote and 3rd zone triggering, why is the dbnote still triggering?

Thanks for your patience, dmitri and for your quick responses.

[dmitri]

Yes in a previous thread you have stated, "For Yamaha cymbals, if BThreshold is set to 18 and Threshold to 40, then hits with simultaneous switch level below 18 will be registered as a bell, hits with simultaneous switch level between 18 and 40 will be registered as an edge, hits with simultaneous switch level above 40 will be registered as a bow." This means that thresholds are the numbers between which the hits register as a certain note, the velocities at which I hit it is represented by this number and thus should be the corresponding note.

Everything is still converting to the dampened note despite having Bthreshold at 0 and the DBnote at 0 which effectively should disable the note, the MIDI Log reads the following:

0.244 10 0x99 0x00 0x02 C -1 Note On

0.256 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off

1.474 10 0x99 0x00 0x03 C -1 Note On

0.261 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off

1.367 10 0x99 0x00 0x01 C -1 Note On

0.261 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off

0.653 10 0x99 0x00 0x01 C -1 Note On

0.254 10 0x99 0x00 0x00 C -1 Note Off


I know you said, "Set BThreshold to 0 to disable 3rd zone triggering/get rid of Dampened note triggering" and "make sure you have a separation between bow and edge zone," this is what I have been trying to do. But the dampened note takes over despite where I hit the PCY135 even with the Bthreshold set to 0 which should disable it.

Also for you're second piece of advice "If you don't get choke when you press the edge switch or you don't get edge triggering then you have to raise Threshold on the edge just as I advised you in the previous post." I have been trying this also, raising the threshold on the edge slowly with no choke notes whatsoever being detected despite how hard being pressed. The only note going through is the DBNote. I raised this to the maximum level from 0 by small increments to no success.

If BThreshold set to 0 disables the DBnote and 3rd zone triggering, why is the dbnote still triggering?

Thanks for your patience, dmitri and for your quick responses.

But in your previous message your wrote:

I set the Bthreshold now to 0 to disable the 3rd zone/dampening, I had tried this before and now it only reads rim hits or head hits depending on which on threshold is lower

Which contradicts what you say now. So, which statement is correct? If the last statement is correct then you have a short on the ring (edge and bell zones) of the cable/jack to the ground.

Also, setting DBNote (or any other note but Note) won't disable it.

[chunkyfatboy]

Yes I have been messing with the settings quite a bit, but my most recent post is what is happening now. I did buy my cymbals used and I pray that it is not a short . The only reason I don't think it is a short is because at super lower thresholds (1-7) on the head/bow and rim/edge I am able to receive the other rim and head shots through the MIDI Log but only based on which threshold is lower. Meaning that if my rim/edge is set to 1 that it will pick up everything or if the head/bow is set to 1 that it will show up on my midi log.

The DBnote is still triggering and overpowering everything if the head/bow and rim/edge are set to normal thresholds (ie. 20 or more) and the Bthreshold is set to 0. That is where I am at now.

When Bthreshold is set to 0 and I hit anything on the cymbal I am expecting that my rim/edge or head/bow midi message notes will show up but only the DBnote goes through (in this case its set to 0 or Disabled so nothing but C-1 shows.) If Bthreshold is set to 0 and I change the DBNote to lets say F5 then no matter what I hit or where the signal shows up as F5 and my rim/edge and head/bow is simply overpowered.

I have been reading some threads about hard resets for the MegaDrum and am thinking about trying that as soon as I get home from work today, perhaps my old drum set leaked some crappy settings into my new set up.

I guess my question is now, is a short causing everything to be read as the DBnote despite having Bthreshold at 0? Or perhaps my afterchoke is permanently stuck on? Or the biggest question I have is, Do i still need to mess with my threshold on my rim/edge and head/bow until they start reading or should I still try to figure out this 3rd zone triggering mess?

I was hoping that the thresholds on rim/edge and head/bow could be adjusted to fix the 3rd zone triggering.

I am determined to get these cymbals figured out. they seem to trigger perfectly as single zones :\

Thanks again dmitri for your help, also sorry about the conflicting messages, my most recent post is what is happening currently.

[dmitri]

Set both Threshold and BThreshold on the Edge to 0. Do you still get DBNotes?

[chunkyfatboy]

Oh wow! That is something different... Hrmm no I am not receiving anymore DBnotes with Threshold and Bthreshold at 0. It is registering as my Head/bow note D4 now (my DBnote is D#4) so this is really good news I hope!

After tapping all three zones I received a midi log of this:

0.271 10 0x99 0x3e 0x00 D 4 Note Off

1.859 10 0x99 0x3e 0x0c D 4 Note On

0.267 10 0x99 0x3e 0x00 D 4 Note Off

0.583 10 0x99 0x3e 0x30 D 4 Note On

0.265 10 0x99 0x3e 0x00 D 4 Note Off

1.235 10 0x99 0x3e 0x24 D 4 Note On

0.265 10 0x99 0x3e 0x00 D 4 Note Off

I am hoping that this means that I can still mess with my thresholds and high levels and eventually get a perfect setup. I will post any updates I receive tonight, I will be messing with this all tomorrow and tonight.

Can you tell by this if my cymbal is actually shorted? Or is it a combination of thresholds and high levels that I must adjust to fine tune?

Thanks again for your quick responses as always Dmitri I am thankful.

[dmitri]

Start raising Threshold on the Edge by 1 at a time until you start to get reliable edge triggering when you hit the edge and reliable bow triggering when you hit the bow.

[chunkyfatboy]

When I started raising my Threshold on the Edge by 1 each time I noticed something very strange. Between 1 and 3 Threshold on my Edge I receive my bow notes C4. Anything after 4 threshold on my edge and I receive nothing but DBnotes again even with Bthreshold still at 0. It seems anything above 4 threshold on my edge forces the DBnote to trigger everything.

I am still trying even higher thresholds as you advised (I am at 30 now with single digit testing each time) but it still reads my DBnotes. I was thinking of setting the DBnote to my head/bow as I can live without choke notes but I'd like to get the three zones here working.

Attached is my findings. The top left is my MegaDrum Manager and the bottom right shows my MIDI Log transition between C4 note (my head/bow note) at Threshold on the Edge at 3. The bottom of the MIDI Log shows the transition when I switch the Threshold Edge to 4 and it shows how the log is reading my DBnote (in this case D#4). So basically anything above threshold edge 4 seems to trigger this while the Bthreshold is still set at 0.

I am still raising the threshold on the edge by one right now but the DBnotes taking over again.

I appreciate your response and patience in this matter. thank you!

[dmitri]

When I started raising my Threshold on the Edge by 1 each time I noticed something very strange. Between 1 and 3 Threshold on my Edge I receive my bow notes C4. Anything after 4 threshold on my edge and I receive nothing but DBnotes again even with Bthreshold still at 0. It seems anything above 4 threshold on my edge forces the DBnote to trigger everything.

If DBNote takes over above Threshold 4 no mater which input you try the cymbal in, I'm afraid you have a short to the ground on the edge/bell. You can test it with a multimeter by measuring resistance between the sleeve and the ring - it should be infinite resistance (or above 1MOm depending on how a accurately you use the multimeter).

[chunkyfatboy]

Dang thank you so much for your patience in this matter. I will just use them as single piezo cymbals I suppose then, yes it seems to be happening on all my cymbals on all inputs. I wont be buying used anymore thats for sure... I guess I should be thankful they respond at all to single piezo... There goes 400 dollars worth of 5 cymbals.

Is there anyway to repair them once they've shorted? Or should I not even bother taking them apart?


Thanks Dmitri I was hoping it was me the user using the technology wrong, but these things happen. At least now when people are using used PCY 135 and PCY 155 they will be able to tell from this post why they are only triggering their DBnote 3rd zone bells. I had read some posts of this happening to people and at least we all have an answer now as to why.