Problem setting MD parameters

[kimouette]

Hi everyone,

I completed my A to E snare using the "traditional" crossbar construction with DIY cone, double-layer of window screen mesh head+ 2X 27mm piezo (head+rim).

I've tried a lot of different combinations all based on the tips and documentation Dmitri wrote for us. But I've got a headache! I'm not very familiar with MIDI monitoring so basically all my attempts to set the parameters correctly are based on what I hear... not a good thing I guess! Cuz of course depending on what sounds I use in Battery 3 the MD setup must be changed!

So I decided to chose one specific sound made of 20 sounds (above pic shows the mapping of these sounds) but something's wrong cuz I dont get any realistic results! I dont know if it's a "physical" problem or just some parameters I didnt set up correctly, but maybe by looking at the printscreens, one of you can tell me what the problem is?

The midi monitoring I've added shows 3 single "normal" hits. I was suprised to see so many "note on" and "note off"! Would it be normal?

I'm sure the problem is obvious for a lot of you, but please believe me when I say that I've tried to understand and play with these settings before asking this question...

[dmitri]

I guess you have false (double) triggering.
Retrigger, DynLevel and DynTime are the main settings to eliminate false/double triggering. Of course other settings, e.g. HighLevel, HiLvlAuto, Threshold, Gain must be properly adjusted for your pads as well.
But of course the pads by itself should produce reasonably clean signal, otherwise, e.g. due to extensive 'after hit' piezo vibration, MegaDrum won't be able to eliminate false triggering.

[dmitri]

Also I find strange that you set Threshold quite high and yet HighLevels are quite low for such Thresholds. How did you come to these settings?

[NovaKaine]

Within Battery 3 itself did you adjust the output latency?
Try around 35 milliseconds and see if that solves your problem
You may have to fiddle with the slider depending on your soundcard.

[kimouette]

Just wanted to say thanks to Dmitri and Novokaine for the suggestion! This week I have to work like a slave and every night when I come home all I can think of is eat and sleep.
So I'll try to go further and use your advises this coming weekend. I'll give some feedback.

[kimouette]

Ok so I still didnt get enough time on my own to reach the "perfect" settings for my MD! But things are little better.

First thing I tried (and it really did help) was to unstretch the mesh head a little bit on all 3 pads (the rebound did'nt feel right anyway), and lowered my snare piezo a little.

Then I decided to put the exact same sample on my snare and my 2 toms and reset the MD parameters to default and start from there.
First thing I noticed : the 3 pads give very different responses!
They all involve double triggering, but at different levels. You are right Dmitri, Threshold and Retrigger are the main responsible for this double false triggering problem. I did manage to find a combination where the false triggering disappeared, but I could only consider it perfect if I was the kind of person with only one arm!
I mean, single hits will visualy look right, and sound right too, but then when doing a drum roll, or in other words, when retriggering a little too fast, that setting becomes a problem. Trying to adjust the threshold and retrigger to find the perfect "balance" didn't work either. The best compromise I found was to allow double (false) retriggering (that I can see but cant hear) just enough to get a realistic SOUND.

I also tried adjusting the latency in Battery 3, but that doesn't solve the problem. This is obviously not a latency problem.

Like I said, I didn't get the chance to really conclude this issu (and with the Config tool not working right for Mac, the task takes even longer!), but as soon as I have 2 hours or so on my own, I'll get back to that problem.

Oh and one question to all you guys who did find the perfect MD settings for their snare...

Have you managed to find a combination where fast/light drumrolls and hard single hits both sound realistic?

[dmitri]

First, I'm going to release a new firmware today/tomorrow with a general improvement to a false triggering suppression. Also, in this firmware I'm going to introduce an alternative algorithm which should allow a better (in theory, since with my Pintech snare I already have a very good balance between suppression and fast rolls) false triggering suppression. It'll be a new setting where you can select an old algorithm or a new one.

Second, I understand you're comparing triggering with another module. Can you make a recording of a fast left-right-left-right roll with MegaDrum and another module?

Third, if you're still not able to find the fine balance, you can send the pad to me (I will send it back of course) and I'll see what is going on.

[jman 31]

If you are getting three different responses with the three pads then I would look there first. What are you using for the cone (or whatever you have). Is it a diy pickup or something you bought. Can you post up a picture of one of your pads?

Typically the cone should stick up between 1/16" to 1/8" above the bearing edge. That is not set in stone of course, but a good place to start.

Are all of the piezos the same on all three pads?

[dmitri]

I just posted a new firmware in http://www.megadrum.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=58 which may help with your particular pads triggering problem.

[macca2004]

kimouette,

I have had similar problems to you with one pad I have

It's a crossbar design
Single zone and I am using a stereo cable even though its a mono pad.

In MIDIOX regardless of the velocity of the hit, it showed 2 note on followed by 2 note offs. Every setting I tried had no affect.

What I found though was that if I changed the setting PIEZO to SWITCH it then triggered perfectly. My setting for dual zone pad was NO.

Not sure why this is happening.